A matter of ethics...

[spiderbraids]

In this post, the ethics of quoting, and the ethics of reviewing.

As mentioned in yesterday's post, I was banned from winx_club for quoting others in my podcast without permission. There are other things that I'm being dinged for, but this one stands out the most for me. (Especially that I'm trying hard to stay away from those other things... hello, 4Kids bashing!)

Personally, I don't see what the big deal is about quoting people. I mean, unless I'm twisting their quotes around for malicious purposes (which I'm NOT), and if I give credit where credit's due (which I AM), I don't see why I would need permission to quote anyone. I've always considering quoting fair game. At Toon Zone Forums, you can automatically quote the previous post to make a point, and if you know the code ([quote][/quote]), you can quote anything from anywhere. Permission? Who needs it?

In fact, I've always thought that if someone saw their quote being used straight, they'd be a bit flattered. Instead, one group moderator actually told me not to use his quotes without permission, and he even emailed me, with not so kind words, over my use of a quote of his, plus an excerpt from another mod's fic, in a podcast... two weeks after it had been released. I stopped making direct quotes in posts (instead settling for links to the relevant discussion), but apparently, direct quotes were also not fair game in podcasts either. And so... DING!!! (Since then, I've edited out the "offending" comments. Actually, I edited them out before I got banned.)

However, and if this puts me back in good faith with the community's moderators, I'm willing to bend over backwards and ask for permission for each and every quote from now on. Starting with any comments that are posted in this journal.

Quoting isn't the only "fair game" I've had issues with, however. Making an honest-to-goodness review of a fanfic has gotten me into trouble as well.

About 1 1/2 months before the controversy above, I had gotten into trouble with one of the prominent members of that community over reviewing fanfics that had been sent in for a contest. I subsequently asked him, a few weeks later, that if he didn't like the idea of me reviewing the fics, maybe he should review them himself. In a nutshell, he replied that just because he gets a fanfic doesn't mean it requires a review. (He also barred me from posting reviews of fics that were on his site again.)

I will admit that he's had problems with me pointing out all the negative aspects of the fics (and all the fics in the contest had many flaws... even the winning fic had a HUGE flaw). But why preclude any kind of review altogether? What about the positive aspects that should be praised? Surely there should be room for reviewing. I mean, doesn't FanFiction.net have feedback forms for reviews? So, why does he think that the fics on his site shouldn't be reviewed? I just find it weird...

Your two cents, anyone?

Comments

[tanz-fanatika.livejournal.com]

In the case of the mod who emailed you, I think it's rather obvious that she's a she. Not a he. Or rather, it would be obvious if you paid attention to any posts in the community but yours.

As for quoting, a lot of the issue stems from the way you use the quotes and your rep. A lot of people don't want to be connected to you in any way because they don't like you or what you do. I mean, just look at ddrfan's response for an example. It's a matter of etiquette, as well. It's POLITE to ask someone permission if you want to use their work. It shows RESPECT. This isn't the large scale real world here. This is a much smaller, more intricate fandom. It's not like quoting from a published work in a school paper. That's totally different. (Your TZ example is just silly. The quoting feature is to make it clear what you're responding to. It's not using that person's quote elsewhere. It stays contained.) No, there's no legality here. There are no legal reasons you can't use what people say. It's done all the time. BUT the difference is that you were ASKED to talk to people first and get their permission. Like I said, it shows respect for that person. By arguing about it, you're digging your hole even deeper. Do you care about anyone aside from yourself? You don't act like it. You don't take other people's feelings into account at all and are now acting put out because you were asked to be polite. Honestly, what's wrong with you? Did your parents not teach you how to interact properly? Or are they this self-centered, too?

Why do you feel the need to rip apart the work of small children? That's just not right. Yeah, there are plenty of people whose job is to review, but they deal with professional writers! These are fanfic contests for KIDS! WTF is the matter with you? Seriously. Again, you've got to look at scale. Real world vs. small fandom. It's a matter of politeness to not rip apart people's work unless they ask you to. Now FF.net is a completely different thing, I think. Posting that work in public with a review section IS asking for reviews. If you'd been reviewing those, there wouldn't have been issues.

I think you really need to take a look at yourself. Why have you had problems in ToonZone and winx_club? Do you have anyone out of either group that you would call a friend? A large part of your problem in the sense of my community is that you present yourself as some sort of professional nitpicker instead of a fan and potential friend to the other members. A lot of us that post actively have closeknit groups of friends within the community. You distanced yourself from everyone when you should have been friendlier. If people liked you, then you wouldn't get a lot of the negative responses you garner or have the bad rep you do. You should work harder on presenting a positive image. Who cares if you're commenting without adding anything more than "I like it! It's pretty!" or posting something that's been posted before? I've posted the fave fairy poll three or four times now! Posting like that could have gotten you a more balanced image. I tried to help you by telling you that before, but you just didn't listen.

[spiderbraids.livejournal.com]

Quoting issues... I've posted a question to USENET's rec.audio.pro , and they all agree on one thing... it's BAD (and possibly not legal) to quote others without asking for permission first. (Of course, my upcoming podcast apology addresses this issue.) Also, when I quote someone, I say their name first.

Fanfic reviewing... good points, all.

Who cares if you'e commenting without adding anything more than "I like it! It's pretty!" or posting something that's been posted before?

On some boards, there might be people who'd accuse me of trying to inflate my post count if I did this. I know I pointed to my old posts on TZ when someone repeated a fairly fresh topic I wrote... But I guess a board is different from a community...

(Hmm... no thoughts on Musa's hair? Oh yeah, they're all at winx_club)

[tanz-fanatika.livejournal.com]

There's no post count at LiveJournal. Comments are always welcome. It's the posts that people go crazy with sometimes, but still, it's a lot more open than a messageboard.